Rick Warren – I’m a progressive certainly, and I don’t condone the insane slippery slope arguments that Rick Warren put forth about gay marriage (”if we do that then what about polygamy, man marrying animals, pedophile relationships”). Nor do I agree with him about abortion. However, Rick Warren is on the right side of some other very important issues for which we need his voice, and his “audience” (for lack of a better word), such as global warming and poverty.

This is what I expected from Obama and I’m happy to see it.

It is totally “Helpful” to hold the Bush Administration accountable for torture. Helpful for our repairing our global image and helpful for securing the future precedents and standards for our Nation’s ethics, and for eliminating this recruiting symbol for terrorists.

I agree with the recent caller that as much as I dislike Bush, as much as many of us almost enjoyed watching Bush duck, this man attempted to assault the President. If this were a US citizen who did something similar that person would face assault charges in this country. If the hurler doesn’t face some charges, what does that say about potential future visits?

I cannot believe we should “turn the page” on this horrible chapter in our history. It is not looking backward it is holding people accountable: it is criminal.

The rule of law is only for us not for ALL.

To answer Ruth Marcus’ question as to what will be gained by holding the Bush administration responsible for its crimes — in a word: Justice. Justice for those tortured, Justice for those who have had their right to privacy violated. What kind of country are we if we no longer have justice for all?

I cannot believe we should “turn the page” on this horrible chapter of torture in our history. It is not looking backward it is holding people accountable: it is criminal.

The rule of law is not just for “us” but for the powerful too. This was a big big deal what Cheney confessed to and with such arrogance. How do we tell the next generation thuggery is wrong. War Crimes is not something one studies in history class. Wart Crimes is a recognition that by holding those accountable we truly reject and hopefully work towards eliminating them.

Shame on your guest; what is she thinking?

Dear Mr. Ashbrook and Guests,

I was disappointed by the throwing of shoes at our president. The journalist wasn’t quick enough with his throw. Even so, I feel that he should be unconditionally freed from custody, given the Congressional Medal of Freedom, and the Pulitzer Prize for some of the best coverage of the war in Iraq

Ruth Marcus’ statement that “we should not criminalize policy” is irrelevant to what has happened. We are an open democracy, our policy is public. Bush stated many times “we do not torture”, and that we followed the law and did not eavesdrop on Americans, for just two examples. That was the “American Policy” (and American law), therefore violations of it are criminal.

Ruth’s comment is really one of solidarity with the ‘ruling class’. We now suspect that there was widespread complicity in many of the Bush administration crimes, so that justifies them. Is it pretty much like Chicago politics? It appears that Blagojevich’s actions are in concordance with the real policy there, just not with the publicly preached policy.

Rick Warren may be on the right side of global warming and poverty, but that doesn’t excuse his dreadful positions on women’s and gay rights. This is a gratuitous insult to Obama’s LGBT supporters and anyone who supports equal rights for all. Rather than building bridges, this invitation sells out a constituency that was solidly behind him and for which he has proclaimed his “fierce support”. What if he had chosen an avowed anti-semite? Would that have been an example of reaching out?

The lack of widespread outrage suggests that Obama will get away with whatever misguided political calculation is behind this move. But in another generation, when homophobia hopefully will be as socially unacceptable as racism is today, this will be widely recognized as an embarrassing blot on his historic inauguration.

Rick Warren? What the hell is Obama thinking.
He is fast losing my confidence and he’s not even in office yet.

This is a slap in the face of all progressives.

As stated Obama seems to have a gotten away with this.
Not with this voter, his cabinet picks and now this are making me think I was lied to by this man.

Yes lied, he’s smart and pragmatic but asking Rick Warren to speak was a HUGE mistake.

He should have had the Poet Laureate, Kay Ryan read a poem.

I was a little upset at Jack Beaty’s hyperconvoluted endorsement of Caroline Kennedy. (Since NY needs money for special ed and Caroline Kennedy has actually raised money for schools, then obviously she was the most qualified to be a senator.)
Then I got the joke.
Jack Beaty was actually was actually sticking it to John McCain! His “endorsement” of CK was actually just a parody of McCain’s endorsement of Sarah Palin. Subsitute “energy” for “special education” and “vice-president” for “senator” and there it is, almost word for word. We only have to be told which countries CK can see out her window for the parody to be complete.
Thanks Jack! It’s good to laugh at ourselves once in a while. And if we can’t laugh at ourselves, we can at least all laugh at you.

Today’s show was a fascinating framework of today’s intellectual. Someday, college students will study a show like this to understand the times. We have 3 perfect conflicts (bi-polar?). We have folks who had a visceral reaction to the idea of S. Palin in office purring at the idea that a sweet mom like C. Kennedy might join the family business. We had a group that fight like jackals to be included getting angry because their main man is being inclusive. And we have a slavish devotion to punishing war crimes at home while we ‘turn the other cheek’ at grave insults from foreigners. Who needs Hollywood!?

This was a comment from today’s NY Times, it came from the opinion page and Paul Krugman’s piece on greed and spacial interest. The author of this get’s it so right that I felt the need to copy it here. My apologies to Radek, of Portland, Oregon.

The underlying cause of the economic catastrophe is cultural, not just a few bad policies or corrupt officials: The USA now has an excessively adversarial, exploitative, cutthroat culture, undermining the civility, generosity, tolerance and respect that societies need to function. It’s a dysfunctionality that devastates human capital and ruins good people.

— Radek, Portland, Oregon

Fears about the impact of “criminalizing policy” smacks too loudly of plausible deniability, especially when invoked by corporate decision makers. Countless CEO’s have hidden behind the “good intentions” defense when asked to explain in court their greed-based policies. They meant only to help themselves, their families, and their company’s profits BUT unfortunately some people were hurt and died from their products: cigarettes, the Dalkon shield, Union Carbide’s Bhopal tragedy /fiasco.
Criminalize the motive, if holding people accountable for real outcomes is too much of a stretch for you.

How about reinstating the Constitution and re-establishing that the POTUS is NOT above the law. There are enough listed areas for investigation that we CANNOT let the past 8 years go unexamined.

To protect the country is not an excuse for lawbreaking by those sworn to uphold the law! Not even a true Declaration of War against a state player is reason to break our laws unnecessarily. Torture hasn’t been demonstrated publicly as a “deterrent.” The only “plots” prosecuted so far are mostly FBI informant stings.

As Dan Froomkin says in his WaPo column today, the only terrorist attack that we have information about is 11 September 2001. Despite multiple warnings from Richard Clarke & others – this Administration was too busy navel-gazing to investigate – As SecState Rice has stated over the past couple of days, they expected to find out when, where – How about spurring real investigations instead of muddying the waters by illegally wiretapping & datamining all of the non-criminal citizens? It wasn’t done because POTUS/VPOTUS had their own agenda & they didn’t care and they don’t care now.

Ruth Marcus says the new administration should say that torture will not be tolerated and then change the subject, but by not holding those responsible for these crimes accountable we are saying to the world and history in a voice louder than words that these actions have been and will be “tolerated.”

Even as a hard core liberal, I truly appreciate the shrewdness behind Warren giving the invocation and Lowery the benediction. If you think about it, the juxtaposition actually serves to reinforce the church state separation doctrine. Additionally, it highlights the reality that theology is man-made and each of us is entitled in this country to be wrong about the “will of God”.

I also find it somewhat ironic that in this context, the invocation is in fact the ending prayer of the nation after the Bush years while the benediction is in fact the “Go forth” prayer of the new era!

The only thing more interesting would have been to have Jeremiah Wright do both prayers, which would have been more “Christian” from my point of view, but more polarizing. And politics is about finding both possibilities and limitations that we may not always delight in individually but which can hopefully help each of live better collectively.

In stead of railing against preachers like Warren, perhaps we need to advocate more lucidly and rationally for social justice. The guy has a following which must be reckoned with…all we can hope for is that truth ultimately wins – and that we in fact, have it on our side!

One more issue, Warren is antisemitic, he believes that all Jews will go to hell. This is not a good choice.
This man is my enemy, Warren stands for everything I find repulsive in this country, he is a right wing religious zealot delivering his message with a populist overtones and a smile, shame on Obama and his staff.

Okay, I was going to lay off Ruth. But she just can’t seem to get through three sentences without botching one. Rick Warren did not oppose Prop 8 — he supported it. “No On 8″ did a lot wrong — a LOT! — but one thing was not leaving confusion which side of the issue they were on: no! It’s just a verbal slip I know, but she just says some of the dumbest things. The Chicago school system is not ‘perfect’? Wow, bowl me over.

As for being against even a commission on torture and the rule of law, well, I don’t even know what to say there when the position is being advanced by a journalist. Doesn’t look good for accountability and the rule of law.

It’s good that obama does not listen to the gay lobby. They need to step back and let a more diverse group of ideas be heard.

Caroline Kennedy is completely unqualified to become a U.S. senator.

Caroline Kennedy is completely unqualified to become a U.S. senator.
Posted by Joe B., on December 20th, 2008 at 10:09 am EST

I grew up in New York and my mother worked in special ed in the NYC school system, hey maybe I should move back and run for Hilary’s seat. One small problem, I’m not rich and I’m not a Kennedy… Come to think of it I’m not qualified either.

Ruth Marcus is completely off base. Why should we not be concerned with “criminalizing policy”? The authorization of torture and the abuses at Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib by the highest American and the opinion of the elite Washington Class (epitomized by Ruth Marcus) to absolve these people is unacceptable. Not looking at the past and investigating those responsible will only ensure these abuses will happen again, and perhaps even worse. When will the Washington Elite learn and why do shows like this (which I happen to enjoy quite a bit) continue to give them a mouthpiece for ridiculous opinions.

I am so glad that America is becoming more and more sympathetic towards these poor terrorist who would love to see every American dead. In their own words: “I shall cross this sea to their islands to pursue them until there remains no one on the face of the earth who does not acknowledge Allah.” Saladin,January 1189. Our torture techniques,whether necessary or not, are so much more horrible than theirs. At least their victims do not have to suffer, they saw our heads off with a knife. If I could prevent the deaths of Americans from this ideology and the methods of torture were of the kind we have used to insure our safety, so be it. We did not ask for their insane ideology of killing those who are Christians/infidels as demonstrated by 9/11,or what they are planning to do to us in the future. Ask those people who live in these Islamic countries who have converted to Christianity what torture really is.
A rabid animal in your yard around your children needs no sympathetic delays,hard and undesirable choices must be made. I wish every form of torture were gone. Even the ones we Americans inflict everyday on each other, drugs, murder, rape, child abuse, spousal abuse, robbery and the list goes on. We condemned Hitler for his millions yet we legalize the 40 million unborn we have killed in torture like adortions. Shame on us.

As for the poor homosexuals and their rights,they have every right that is granted to each American. What they do not have is: to become the gender they despise to be attracted to naturally, to have sex in unnatural ways and to try to legalize what in practice is sin. What they want by historical accounts is one of many signs of a decaying society. Check your history, we are following in the same steps as all the great societies of the past who fell,we are about 3/4 of the way to our society making the same mistakes as they did. Freedom to do what ever I want was at the core of their failures. I am not a homophobic, I am a follower of Jesus Christ,the Son of the Living God, whom our country is so recklessly trying to deny. If we try to fight against God and His precepts, we will lose!!

[...] utterance in question, made during an interview on Tom Ashbrook’s On Point Friday, is repeated in essence in her Washington Post column [...]

David you sound like a zealot, much like the Islamic fundamentalist you condemn. Maybe you should take to heart the teachings of your lord Jesus Christ, compassion would be a good place to start.

By the way it was not only Christians who died on 9/11, there were Muslims, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, Atheists, and Agnostics.

jeff, no I am not a Zealot, I am just a Christian. I do take to heart the compassion that Jesus teaches. I can take no vengeance on my enemies,but to love and pray for them. The government is responsible for punishing evil doers, and to reward the righteous so that we can live a peaceful life. But it seems our citizens and government has forgotten their responsibilities. True, there were many groups killed on 9/11, the terrorist could care less about them, they were attacking our fundamental beliefs as a nation. We are seen as a Christian nation which is according to their belief, a infidel belief needing to be wiped out. Evidenced by the statements aways made towards Israel by Iran. I would love to see all nations work together for the good of all, but throwing caution to the wind when the rabid animal is in your yard will only get you hurt. Compassion should be a two way street, Americans have always been the most compassionate nation around, even to those who dislike us,for that, I take pride in our nation.

You sound like one to me, or your getting to close fro comfort. I do not believe in a mystical being that lives in space. However I don’t think our nation should break international laws nor should we let our government deface and disgrace our rule of law. The terrorist are still going to do what they will. The way to control them, and that’s all we can do, is to have good intelligence.
Fighting terrorism is a police action, not a war.

I don’t think using metaphors such as ‘rabid dogs’ helps the argument.

More Americans die from car accidents caused by drunk drivers then from the hands of terrorists.

You want to talk about terrorism all you want, what about the damage that Wall street and the banks have done to our country?

If you ask me our nation is on the brink of collapse, and this was caused by Americans, not terrorist.

“I was ordered to fight all men until they say ‘There is no god but Allah.” Prophet Muhammad’s farewell address. March 632 AD. This sounds like a declaration of war by their revered founder. I did not ask for this kind of ideology but it is coming. Intelligence is great, we were forewarned before 9/11 but it still happened. Police action is great, Pakistan is during a jam of job of controlling terrorism. The rabid animal metaphor was intended to reflect a naive mindset that was present before 9/11,that bad people will never hurt us here in America. Greed for power, riches, control over others has always led to conflict. I wish it were not that way. I agree,laws should be followed,not only by us but also by them. That is the problem, they do not care for international laws. Sorry you are not a believer.

Was it not Christ who through out the money changers from the temple in Jerusalem, greed is a sin, as much as murder is. In 632 AD devout Christians would burn people at the stake.

While I understand the context of your misgivings for the extremist in the Muslim world I would remind you that extremism exists in other ideologies as well.
I think most people want the same thing for themselves, their families and children. They want hope, a safe environment to prosper and to live in peace.

I find it hard to believe in magic, angles or some large man in space who is sitting in some mystical kingdom looking down an contemplating my existence.
I find that a bit presumptuous that people actually think that this chap sitting there on some cloud or something is deciding your fate. Why your fate and not that of the shrew? Do shrews pray?

To deny the existence of the Amighty God, when even nature itself declares His greatness is so sad for those who do not believe. I wish all people could come to know Him. All will,the moment after their death. Hang in there jeff. True Christians never burned anyone at the stake, only those apostates who made up the rules as they went.

“nature itself declares His greatness”

Do you have any empirical or scientific proof of that?

If God is so almighty then why are things so screwed up?
If he and I suppose it is a he, (as George Carlin has said; no woman would screw it up that much) is that powerful then why do peoples prayers go unanswered?

I know, I know, God works in mysterious ways, which brings me back to magic.

Having faith or belief in spiritual things is not the same as being religious.

When I look at what is created,the earth,the universe, the human body,living creatures, I see order. Science will prove that all the above has order and is designed to function in a precise way. The earth, revolves on its axis every 24 hrs. Around the sun every 365.25 days. Everyday, every year, the same precise time. The universe, shows order and not chaos. Creatures show order, they function for a purpose. The human body, a incredible array of millions of parts showing design and order. Scientific discoveries never know to man were written about in the Bible thousands of years earlier than when man found them. Historical documents written centuries ago show validity. Josephus tells of many evidences of actual divine envolvement in the lifes of people. There is enough out there to prove God exist. But skeptics will always find doubt. Looking at the above mentions, what stands out loudly is “order” and this requires a intelligent design. The thought that all this oozed out of nothing or ground or the ocean is a insult to our intelligence. If something comes from nothing, then if I throw the parts of a new care in my basement, eventually it will become a car. Are why has monkeys stopped becoming humans? God gives us free agency, we have the right to choose whether to believe or disbelieve, screw things up or make them better.

That’s a nice sermon David, however it proves nothing.
The bible never mentioned anything about the physics of freezing the gas hydrogen to create a liquid. It never came up with Newtons laws on how light and color works.
Newton was a pretty religious man by all accounts, except he also was into Alchemy, which would have had him burned at the stake in his day if anyone found out about it.

The bible is nothing more than a nice story filled with tales and parables and a lot of sex and violence.
Some good dietary laws as well as some common sense civility laws.

The thought that all this oozed out of nothing or ground or the ocean is a insult to our intelligence.

Ahh there’s the rub, you’re upset that life can exist without human endeavor. Yet for 150 million years dinosaurs roamed the earth without a thought about humans. Why, because there were none. Bit of a problem that, the hundreds of millions of years that life existed on this planet without any humane intelligence or design. By the way there was no design, no intelligent being sitting space making executive decisions about what the world should be.

“Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.” “but God has chosen the foolish things of the world to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to shame the things which are strong”. My faith in what many disclaim as a myth has given me a comfort and great joy and satisfaction for nearly 57 years. I could not live a more satisfied life without it. By the way, there is a growing number of big thinkers who now conclude the earth is only around 5,000 years old. Time will time and death will prove it to all.

By the way, there is a growing number of big thinkers who now conclude the earth is only around 5,000 years old. Time will time and death will prove it to all.

You have got to be kidding. “big thinkers”, this is your answer. I love the last line, “time will time”? time will time what? This does not make any sense whatsoever.

I suppose you believe in fairies, goblins trolls and dragons as well. The notion of the earth being only 5000 years old has been proved to a huge hoax over and over and over again. Yet the born again christian ideologues of the world hang on to this fantasy. They call this blind faith. You offer no proof, no scientific information other than religious humdrum. The ‘big thinkers’ you mention are cherry picked scientist who have let there beliefs cloud their rational thoughts.

Religious belief is a personal thing.
That’s why we have the separation of Church and State.

It’s great that you find so much comfort in your religion. To think that it’s and absolute is foolish in my view. It’s false promises and exaggerated claims, that’s what it is to me. The idea that some all powerful being who sits in the sky and has a list of ten things he does not want you do is absurd.

George Carlin sums it up in ways I never could.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o