
Egyptian activists are confronted by police during a protest in Cairo against the Israeli attacks in Gaza, on Dec. 31, 2008. (AP)
Israel announced today it will pause its attack on Gaza three hours a day for humanitarian relief. The other 21 hours a day, the Israeli action goes on. The pounding. From the air. On the ground.
The whole world is watching — the Arab world, closest of all. Arab television is wall-to-wall images of Gaza death and destruction: women, children, hospitals, morgues soaked in blood, Hamas counterattacks framed as defiance, the United States and Israel linked as one. Arab leaders portrayed as ineffectual.
Where does this go? This hour, On Point: Israel’s neighborhood, the Arab world, watching Gaza.
-Tom Ashbrook
Guests:
Roula Khalaf, Middle East editor of The Financial Times.
Labib Kamhawi, Jordanian political analyst.
Tamara Wittes, director of the Middle East Democracy and Development Project at the Saban Center for Middle East Policy at Brookings Institution.
Tags: Gaza, Hamas, Israel, Israeli-Palestinian conflict












Nasrallah says Hizbullah ready to fight Israel
Posted by R.M., on January 7th, 2009 at 8:47 AMJanuary 6, 2009 by Ricki Hollander
Norwegian Doctors in Gaza: Objective Observers or Partisan Propagandists?
Mads Gilbert
The source of most of the information coming from Gaza thus far has been from Palestinian representatives. One of the only non-Palestinian voices heard has been that of Mads Gilbert, a Norwegian doctor who entered Gaza on December 31 along with his colleague Erik Fosse
Posted by R.M., on January 7th, 2009 at 9:24 AMostensibly to provide medical assistance to Palestinians at Shifa Hospital. In fact, Gilbert appears in so many interviews that one wonders how he has the time to provide medical help, never mind “doing surgery around the clock” as he claims.
fROM :CAMERA (COMMITTEE FOR ACCURACY IN MIDDLE EAST REPORTING IN AMERICA)
The delegitimization of the US and the ‘moderate” Arab regimes continue apace. As a commentary in Financial Times points out, our support for Israel continues to give China and Russia a stupendous geopolitical advantage. As Americans we will soon no longer be able to afford the luxury of supporting a state whose existence is predicated on the privileging of one foreign ethnic group over the rights of the indigenous inhabitants. In our rapid relatively declining state we can not continue to support 6 million at the cost of our political standing and our own economic interests with over 1 billion Arab and Muslims and 5 billion citizens represented in the UN General Assembly.
Posted by Loay, on January 7th, 2009 at 10:18 AMhttp://www.juancole.com/2009/01/palestinian-girl-israeli-troops.html
Posted by Ronald Johnson, on January 7th, 2009 at 10:26 AMIt seems like Israel wants to forestall any kind of resolution as long as possible so it can create more facts on the ground via settlements. The long drawn-out negotiations and periodic flareups like the current one in Gaza seem, over the long term, to function mainly as cover for more settlements. I think the US needs to reduce its support of Israel so that the need for a genuine and lasting peace becomes the a more urgent priority than the desire for more territory.
Posted by Gordon, on January 7th, 2009 at 10:38 AMI think this is another trick question.
How about we ask:
* “Who supports a TWO state solution?:
* Do you support the original (first) resolution ever made by the UN, in 1948? It was for a two state solution….Forget 1967. Let’s take the ORIGINAL
1948 UN solution.
And start by saying, EVERY Single Arab country REJECTED it, but Israel Accepted it (then too!)
That needs to be the start to mid-east peace.
Accept a two state solution, on the proposed 1948 borders.
Oh yeah, let’s really go back to 1924, when Sir Winston (jackarse) totally messed up the Mideast for the first time when he was High Commissioner of Palestine, and he gave away HALF of the existing British Mandate to a “poker buddy” to create a new state called “Jordan”, which never existed before that!
If you take THAT as the full land of “PALESTINE”, then the ENTIRE “arab” (palestinian) area would be in Jordan, take a look at the UN Archives where I found that.
Go check out my blog for more info
Posted by markbrown in NJ, on January 7th, 2009 at 10:40 AMThree hours for Israel to reload and put the coordinates for schools in targeting systems.
Posted by Majawill, on January 7th, 2009 at 10:51 AMIn the report on the bombing of the UN school, nothing has been mentioned of the AP report,
According to the Associated Press, two Palestinian residents said “they saw a small group of militants firing mortar rounds from a street near the school, where 350 people had gathered to get away from the shelling. They spoke on condition of anonymity for fear of reprisal.”
And the fact that secondary explosions, signifying stored munitions, were detected that resulted in the majority of the casualties.
And as far as “occupation” is concerned, it wasn’t as hermetic as claimed. Missiles were being brought in, and were being sent out. And the Gazans were not suffering so much as claimed.
And as far as the legitimacy of Hamas, legitimacy is not something that Hamas really wants.
Posted by Avram Kalisky, on January 7th, 2009 at 10:54 AMWe just spoke on the phone with friends in Be’er Sheva, Israel. As we were on the phone, the siren went off and closely there after we heard the explosion of a bomb. This is very real for those who are there, and there is no legitimacy whatsoever for Hamas’s costant bombardment of Israel land for the past several years. Israel has simply given up on being civilized, when they are up against non-civilized entities…
Posted by Tal, on January 7th, 2009 at 10:55 AMWas listening to the program and the entire media.
Unfortunately, this program and others cannot do the right thing – which is asking “Why”.
Hamas/Palestinians were sealed from the outside world, with no income and limited resources, and they are sending rockets to Ashkelon. Either they are Crazy or they have a good reason.
Then looked up Ashkelon in Wikipedia. What do you see. Textbook definition of Ethnic Cleansing – truckloads of Palestinians were expelled to Gaza from Ashkelon. If this has happened between 1948-1950, according to International Law…. IT IS ILLEGAL.
But that is not the problem. The problem is that not One Single Media outlet ever ever ever talked about this.
Posted by Lilya Lopekha, on January 7th, 2009 at 10:58 AMJust heard a segment on the first hour where you stated the coverage of an Iranian TV station. The voice was clearly Arabic in the background. Iranian TV is not in Arabic. Please double check on your source. Iran is continuously being portrayed in a negative light by the American media. I expect more credible coverage from npr.
Posted by Fariba, on January 7th, 2009 at 11:03 AMhttp://www.HumanGenome.org/Ashkelon.mht
Posted by Lilya Lopekha, on January 7th, 2009 at 11:16 AMHere is the solution to the entire problem, once and for all….
http://www.HumanGenome.org/SolutionToMiddleEast.htm
Posted by Lilya Lopekha, on January 7th, 2009 at 11:18 AMIsrael’s national interests and values are not always America’s. Take the case of Israel’s government seeking (cheap convenient) access to Gaza’s huge natural gas fields- Gaza Marine Gas Fields.
Posted by Alison, on January 7th, 2009 at 11:48 AMThe lies of Massacres that come from the Palestinian and Arab media are well known ….Please stop believing all these fabricated lies that pollute the Arab Media. The excuse is always the OCCUPATION ….but when the Israeli left Gaza they were immediately attacked …..They don’t want the Israeli to leave , because that would mean they would not have an excuse to receive money from the international communities …and the leaders would stop putting that money in Swiss bank accounts just like Arafat did (his so called wife is leaving it up in Paris ) . All of you who believe all the massacres , are just pawns in their game ……Its easy if recently they wanted to stop the Israeli from coming into Gaza , they would have stopped sending rockets deliberately hitting innocent women and children in Israel ..They need to get over this constant hatred of Jews in Arab countries .Enough PALLYWOOD …YOUTUBE PALLYWOOD …..
Posted by R.M., on January 7th, 2009 at 12:50 PMDear Mr Ashbrook,
Please review the history of this last year before simply repeating the Israeli narrative — as you did in the intro to today’s show. Apparently you believe Israeli claims that its bombing of Gaza is a matter of responding to Palestinian rocket fire.
The facts show otherwise.
Israel had blockaded the border for months (thereby depriving Palestinians of food, fuel, and other necessities of life). This blockade resulted in great hardship and no doubt deaths (at the very least due to medical emergencies). I believe Israel also had killed 22 Palestinians during the so called truce. I repeat — Israel broke the truce and killed Palestinians. Hamas (in one instance discussed in the AP article below) responded with two rockets.
So, the idea that Israel was simply responding to thousands of rockets is false. A series of events, beginning with the initial siege and followed by tunnel building from Gaza, reprisals by Israel…, prompted the present situation with thousands of rockets.
In my view, Israel is committing war crimes for its own political purposes and based upon on a history of paranoia, settlement expansion, and use of military might rather than negotiation.
S. Cohen
(Jewish American)
This from AP earlier in Dec.
* Associated Press
* The Guardian, Saturday 20 December 2008
* Article history
Hamas yesterday announced the end of an often-breached truce with Israel and Palestinians in the Gaza Strip by firing two rockets into Israel.
The Israeli military also said troops in fields adjoining Gaza came under sniper fire from across the border.
There were no injuries reported in any of the incidents.
In a statement on its website, Hamas said Israel had breached agreements by imposing a blockade on Gaza and staging military strikes into the densely populated coastal strip.
“Since the enemy did not abide with the conditions … we hold the enemy fully responsible for ending the truce and we confirm that the Palestinian resistance factions headed by Hamas will act,” the statement said.
Israel says the six-month-old truce, brokered by Egypt, never had an official expiry date, but it is interested in prolonging what it calls “understandings” with Hamas.
The Islamic group, which seized control of the Gaza Strip in June 2007, is listed as a terrorist organisation by Israel.
The truce has increasingly unravelled since early November, when Israeli troops entered Gaza to destroy a tunnel that could have been used in a cross-border raid. In response, Palestinian militants resumed firing rockets at Israel.
Even before the truce began fraying, Israel did not allow free transfer of goods in and out of Gaza. Since cross-border fighting resumed in November, Israel has kept the borders virtually sealed, allowing in only minimal humanitarian aid.
Posted by Stephan Cohen, on January 7th, 2009 at 1:46 PMJew history is not of exclusive sufferrings only. It’s also and for the main part the history of a successful integration and tremendous achievements, making them the most “consequential diaspora” in the world.You will hardly find a country in the world without a citizen of jew descent, most of them enjoying full citizenship(Sarkozy,Pompidou, Einstein,Chomsky, Elvis, Johnny Hallyday,the Rotshilds…just to name a few!!!)My point is that those achievements were possible because of the acceptance and tolerance of other ethnic groups. So why not a diverse an secular Israel/Palestine?Is the formula of a “jew state”so neccessary?
Ben Gourion was first offered Uganda by the british to settle, but they refuse opting for Palestine for divers reasons.Sometimes i wonder what it would have been like…Israel in the center of Africa:apartheid or the continental leader for development?
Posted by Bobako, on January 7th, 2009 at 3:03 PMIt just may be that there will be no peace in the middle east until there is a reform movement in islamdom.
Posted by Frederic C., on January 7th, 2009 at 3:50 PMIs there something wrong with Islam?
Are we free to even question?
Posted by Frederic C., on January 7th, 2009 at 3:51 PM[Sorry about the three entries]
How do religions compare objectively? Is Islam/the Islam of today fated to be forever incompatible with the cultures of progress? I don’t know, that’s why I’m asking. Is there a ‘progressive,’ Islam?
Elevate Hezbollah or Hamas to non-terrorist entities able to talk directly to Israel?
Of course Hezbollah plays a basic ‘bread and butter,’ or perhaps a ’sugar-daddy,’ role, otherwise they would be entirely intolerable in Lebanon. They each hold their citizens captive. How the average Lebanese citizen or Palestinian bite the hand that feed them? A mass Stockholm Syndrome.
One state solution? Right of Palestinian return?
Posted by Frederic C., on January 7th, 2009 at 5:29 PMHow? It would be one more vote, one more time and ffftt. Over. Hello diaspora2.
In the words of one of their own, “We will export our revolution throughout the world…until the calls ‘there is no god but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of Allah’ are echoed all over the world.”
Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, 1979
“I was ordered to fight the people until they say there is no god but Allah, and his prophet Muhammad.”
Osama bin Laden,2001
This is what they understand as their duty under Islam. To be a Jew are a Christian puts you at odds with their belief. The Iranian leaders have already expressed their desire to fulfill their duty under Islam in regards to Israel. We have seen how they feel towards us several years ago. What will resolve this problem and end the conflict? It is clearly stated in the above two quotes.
Posted by David, on January 7th, 2009 at 7:03 PMhello,
Posted by Neda, on January 7th, 2009 at 7:51 PMI just feel that it is important for people who call and listen both to understand that Iranian government or any other Islamic government does not have an issue with the Jews as a religion. i think that people are forgetting there is a difference between religion and geography.
i am not agreeing or disagreeing with what is going on in mid east, i just think it is important to understand that the problem between these governments, is based on a land and geography and an entitlement to that part of the world not a religion and hating Jews and Muslim
thanks
OMAR from Boston who was on “On Point” talk show today speaking about the Israeli attack on Gaza I would like to speak with you because I admire your clear understanding and articulate exposition of the Palestine and Middle east situation.
Posted by Bruce, on January 7th, 2009 at 8:10 PMI would very much like the opportunity to speak at length with you.
This is not a romantic quest, I am a straight male.
If you see this you can write me at celtillus@yahoo.com
Thanks
Hamas is committing three war crimes, the two I’ve copied from the Geneva Convention just below, and trying to annihilate a UN member nation. A great contributor to the world Islamic outrage is the media not reporting in the context of:
Protocol 1 Additional to the Geneva Conventions, 1977
PART IV: CIVILIAN POPULATION
Section 1: General Protection Against Effects of Hostilities
Chapter II: Civilians and Civilian Population
Article 51: Protection of the Civilian Population
3.Civilians shall enjoy the protection afforded by this Section, unless and for such time as they take a direct part in hostilities.
7. The presence or movements of the civilian population or individual civilians shall not be used to render certain points or areas immune from military operations, in particular in attempts to shield military objectives from attacks or to shield, favor or impede military operations. The Parties to the conflict shall not direct the movement of the civilian population or individual civilians in order to attempt to shield military objectives from attacks or to shield military operations.
And to the ridiculous point of “proportionality,” I give you:
Myths and Facts, “Gaza and International Law “
December 28, 2008 | Eli E. Hertz
What unites Palestinian Arabs is their opposition to Jewish nationalism and a desire to stamp it out – not aspirations for their own state. Murdering Jews is a collective Palestinian Arab effort that requires a collectively sensible response. Israel’s reaction to nearly eight years of shelling Israeli civilian population centers from the Gaza Strip is nothing more than a measured, fair response, designed to effectively terminate armed attacks and more importantly – to prevent its recurrence. All of Israel’s actions in this regard are supported by international law.
Hamas – a United States designated foreign terrorist organization, by their aggression and initial use of armed force against Israeli civilians and non-combatant Jews in breach of the United Nations Charter, constituted prima facie [Latin: on its face] evidence of an act of aggression – aggression being defined by international law as “the most serious and dangerous form of illegal use of force.” 1
Therefore, the rule of proportionality in this case of continuous aggression, needs to be met by Israeli acts that will induce the wrongdoing aggressor to comply with international obligations. A countermeasure need not be the exact equivalent of the breaching act. 2
United Nations Resolutions demand of states to combat terrorism and reaffirm their:
Posted by Moishe, on January 7th, 2009 at 8:49 PM“unequivocal condemnation of all acts, methods and practices of terrorism as criminal and unjustifiable, regardless of their motivation, in all their forms and manifestations, wherever and by whomever committed.” 3
Judge Schwebel, the former President of the International Court of Justice is quoted saying:
“In the case of action taken for the specific purpose of halting and repelling an armed attack, this does not mean that the action should be more or less commensurate with the attack.
[1] See: UN Resolution 3314 (XXIX). Definition of Aggression.
[2] United States Department of State, Draft Articles on State Responsibility, Comments of the Government of the United States of America, March 1, 2001. See: http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/28993.pdf.
[3] See: UNSC 1269, 1368,1373, 1377 .
Seems like reasonable justification for the genocide we are witnessing.
Posted by majawill, on January 7th, 2009 at 11:05 PMlyla lopekha What you are forgetting is that 1 million Jews were kicked out of Arab countries….all their possessions taken away from them …Most more wealthy than Palestinians (who left when told to leave so Jews could be massacred )…Most went to Israel …to live in tents until they could be integrated ….These refugees who finally were integrated by this tiny country called Israel ….make up more than 50% of the population . These Sephardic and Misrahi Jews ….come from Morocco , Tunisia , Algeria , Ethiopia , Yemen ,Iraq, Iran , Libya, Syria , Turkey …Egypt ….These Jews had nothing to do with Europe ….(It would be nice if people would stop rewriting history )…..watch the documentary : forgotten refugees…Read the book: “From Time Immemorial” , by Joan Peters… They too Lyla want compensation ….
Posted by R.M., on January 8th, 2009 at 2:02 AMStephan Cohen ..(so called Jewish , how convenient )..you sir are a liar ..
Posted by R.M., on January 8th, 2009 at 2:11 AMBobako were do you see a secular Arab country?
Posted by R.M., on January 8th, 2009 at 2:35 AMNeda says “I just feel that it is important for people who call and listen both to understand that Iranian government or any other Islamic government does not have an issue with the Jews as a religion. i think that people are forgetting there is a difference between religion and geography.”
Who do you think you are kidding?
Posted by R.M., on January 8th, 2009 at 2:40 AMHamas, elected by Gazans, ran on a position that includes the annihilation of Israel. Iran and Syria supply money and weapoons. Egypt tacitly allows these to come over their border. Hamas sends rockets, with increasing range, over the border daily bombing civilian Israeli targets. Is the issue that Israel has more fire power and is better funded so it should “ignore” that its neighbor on its border is attacking its civilians daily? After all, they aren’t doing a lot of damage yet. What country would ignore this behavior? Is the issue that the response should be “proportional?” You kill four civilians so I get to kill four civilians? I get to fire weak rockets the same distance into your civilian territories? Would the world support an Israeli response that was “proportional?” Don’t be ridiculous. Of course not.
Hamas puts its weapons in hospitals, schools and mosques and its soldiers in ambulances. Its soldiers live among civilians and do not defend them but in fact make every single civilian an involuntary soldier and a target. That gives them maximum physical protection (they are cowards and hide behind their women and children) and maximum propaganda protection: Israelis are killing civilians.
I have no idea what the solution is. Israel exists and if Hamas wishes to destroy Israel it should come as no surprise that the country won’t willingly commit suicide.
As to whether there should be a “jewish” state, Saudi Arabia and other middle eastern states are “muslim” states and allow very few freedoms to non-muslims as well as strictly controlling religious observance within their borders. I think any discussion of whether a state should have a declared religion must be much broader than a discussion of Israel’s right to be a “jewish” state.
If the Islamic world’s concern was about the death of Muslims,far more attention would be paid to the thousands of Sunni suicide bombings killing Shia Iraquis or the thousands of Shia bombings killing Sunni Iraquis or the Sudanese massacre or the Somali internecine killings, etc. The issue isn’t who is killed: it is who is doing the killing, Apparently there is only a moral imperative when it is non-Moslems wielding the weapons.
Posted by deb, on January 7th, 2009 at 7:29 pm EST
Posted by deb, on January 8th, 2009 at 9:47 AMBobako you seem to be illiterate and misinformed.
R.M. Stephan Cohen represents the type of Jewish person who is feeling guilt and are very progressive. Maybe they read the Nation and the Guardian and if they do they will be bombarded with anti-Israeli articles.
I know I am a progressive Jew myself. However I don’t have such a black and white view, partly because I have relatives living in Israel.
Until a real two state solution is put in place there will never be peace. Even after a viable Palestinian state is established there will most likely still be outbreaks of violence as the hatred of the Jews in this region has a long, long history.
People should do a little reading about the subject. If you did you would know that there was never a Palestinian state. One could start with the Balfour Declaration of 1917.
It is a complex history, however one thing is clear that the hatred of Jews by a majority of the Arabs in the region is clearly documented. Look up Hajj Amin El Husseini and the Muslim Brotherhood.
Husseini was an ally of the nazis in WW2 and took refuge in Germany after a failed coup attempt in Iraq.
Iran and how they play into this adds to complexity of the geopolitical issues facing this region.
Posted by jeff, on January 8th, 2009 at 10:15 AMIsrael has created a concentration camp and its name is Gaza. Ironic.
Posted by Majawill, on January 8th, 2009 at 10:17 AMfrom Majawil “Seems like reasonable justification for the genocide we are witnessing.”
The ball is in Hamas ’s hands ….Its very easy for hamas to stop sending rockets into Israel ….They are the one’s holding their babies as shields in order to kill Israelis who are defending their own BABIES …Please after eight years of receiving rockets from hamas and the world staying quiet ….I think the Israelis have a right to defend themselves ……But anyway …the so called massacres and “genocides ” coming from the Palestinians sides …Are always eventually proven to be false and fabricated scenes from their Pallywood movie industry …just look at the Al Dura fiasco which was proven in french court to be completely fabricated on a movie set …..anyone who doesn’t believe it YouTube ….Pallywood …..and Youtube “road to Jenin ” or other Pierre Rehov documentaries ……THESE ARE FACTS…….
Posted by R.M., on January 8th, 2009 at 10:23 AM“Israel has created a concentration camp and its name is Gaza. Ironic.
Posted by Majawill, on January 8th, 2009 at 10:17 am EST”
Mufti of Jerusalim, Amin al-Husseini, toured Nazi death camps during the war and liked what he saw. Ironic.
Posted by Alex, on January 8th, 2009 at 11:35 AMMajawill are you a Palestinian? Do you think all Jews should be driven into the sea, or liquidated like most of the radical Muslim groups?
Your inflammatory comments are juvenile and do nothing to help this tragic event.
Posted by jeff, on January 8th, 2009 at 12:37 PMHamas is getting the same media treatment as the Black Panthers in the 1960s…they are a multi-faceted organization that does a lot more than spew nonsense about destroying Israel…
Posted by Tebogo, on January 8th, 2009 at 3:31 PM“Hamas …they are a multi-faceted organization that does a lot more than spew nonsense about destroying Israel…”
That’s just it. They do other things with what money? Where are the funds coming from? In order to provide the services that they apparently provide the easiest thing is to keep provoking Israel to the use of force so the rest of the World keeps sending them sizable amounts of funds. When Arafat died he had several hundred million dollars in his accounts. I’d be curious to know where the money received by Hamas is going.
Posted by Alex, on January 8th, 2009 at 3:57 PMRead in Wikipedia about Arafat’s wife Suha Arafat …http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suha_Arafat
Posted by R.M., on January 8th, 2009 at 5:53 PMTheir “child” was born in Neuilly sur Seine, a plush and chic suburb of Paris …while his “people” are living in refugee camps …who’s kidding whom ?
Posted by R.M., on January 8th, 2009 at 6:01 PMjeff , all my life I have fought for progressive causes , but that does not mean that I will follow blindly organizations that have agendas….and who pressure the weak to be politically correct ….I believe in human rights and can’t believe the so called left that allies itself with fascists ..
Posted by R.M., on January 8th, 2009 at 6:33 PMWhat a great show Tom. Thanks for having a show focused on the Arab perspective. I thought the caller Omar was fantastic. He seemed to light a fire under Roula Khalaf and perhaps change the direction of the show. Mostly I wanted to say thank you Tom for not following the rest of the MSM in simply parroting Israeli p.r. So refreshing!
Posted by Chris Stone, on January 9th, 2009 at 1:18 AMJeff
I may be a little illiterate(all american academic, who’s who college and university,educated in three continents,English is my third language!)But i’m hardly misinformed.( You don’t know me, and in world affairs,i MAY take you to school, it’s not just books, i’ve been around)
Where have you seen misinformations in my postings? If you don’t like what i say and the questions i’m asking, give your point of view.But facts are facts:That land was not a no-man’s land to be given by the british and that is the origin of the conflict! You need to admit it, any way you cut it!
Aknowledging the injustice done to the palestinians, doesn’t make you anti-jews.
A lot of outstanding jew scholars(not all)loose their sense of fairness when it comes to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
I will let you with quotes of two people(jews americans)that may help you clear some of your biases.
“A great deal of intelligence can be invested, when the need for illusions is deep!”
-Saul Bellow-
“If you really believe it, it’s not a lie”(Paul Castanza in Seinfeld)
Peace
Posted by Bobako, on January 9th, 2009 at 2:24 AMBobako the way you write is hurting the points your trying to get across.
When you write “jews americans”, that’s not a good way to make a point. With all due respect you say your an academic and yet you do not take the time to find the proper way to formulate your ideas in English.
The proper way write this is Jewish Americans.
So what are you suggesting, that Israel should stop existing, all the Jews should go back to wherever their families came from?
I live in the USA so even though my family came here in the 20’s does that mean all non-native Americans should go back to where they came from?
Israel is not going anywhere and people need to except that. I support a two state solution. If the Palestinians have a strong successful country I feel that this would be a huge step in ending the strife in this area.
Posted by jeff, on January 9th, 2009 at 1:37 PMR.M. on January 8th, 2009 at 2:11 am EST said:
“Stephan Cohen ..(so called Jewish , how convenient )..you sir are a liar ..”
R.M. offers a classic example of pro-Israelis incapable of accepting that other pro-Israelis (some having to substantiate this by claiming Jewish hertitage) see the reality that Israel is not always the “good guy,” just as the U.S. is not always the good guy. (Do I have to substatiate being a Viet Nam combat vet?)
As a 3/4 Irish-American, who visited Ireland often in the 1970s, I was horrified by the terrorist actions of the Sien Fein, although I did support their actual ends.
Good people can protest that the ends DO NOT justify the ends, without having to apply their anger to the deaths of peiople thousands of miles away.
So for all you people who draw the wagons close to protect their own, be very careful about the theoretical use of ANY ACTION, until you see the reaity of that killing in the eyes of those people opposing you (or your government).
Posted by Christopher T. Wood, on January 9th, 2009 at 1:46 PMSo Christopher – on that laudable note, what do you propose?
Posted by Alex, on January 9th, 2009 at 3:39 PMJeff
Thanks for the correction.I may question the fairness of some of your assertions, but surely not your mastering of the english language.I’m working on two books in english that i’m trying to get published, a friend like you would have been priceless.
Peace
Posted by Bobako, on January 9th, 2009 at 11:00 PMBobako the other issue is when you call people Jews or those Jews it also has a subtext if it is context to this issue of Israel and Arabs and Palestinians. If I was to aggressive I do apologize. I suppose we both learned a lesson in who forums like this can hurt a discourse due to misunderstandings related to how language is used.
I’m am no master of the English language, which is pretty hard to learn as first language well let alone a third.
My advice to you hire a good editor who is British.
Posted by jeff, on January 9th, 2009 at 11:52 PM@ Jeff
Now to your questions: i’m not suggesting for people to go anywhere.Just one state where palestinians will have full citizenship, where those driven out of their houses and lands be offered just compensations or the right to retun, a secular state with a comprehensive immigration policy.A State with a large jewish population doesn’t neccessary have to be a”jewish state”.Let’s dare to be fair and put an end to the expansion of settlements in the “territories”.How economically viable and livable are those “Strips” and “banks”?
My apology in advance for the poorness of my english, the spontaneous nature of my interventions is also to blame.
( I’ve found some typos in your text,we all sometimes fail to proofread!)except: i knew you meant accept,(your) trying (You’re)
Peace
Posted by Bobako, on January 10th, 2009 at 12:04 AM@ Jeff
I’ve heard you loud and clear,it was unintentional believe me. If i’ve offended anybody, my sincere apology.Words are not just words.
My apology again!
Lesson learned!!!
peace
Posted by Bobako, on January 10th, 2009 at 12:34 AMIsrael will never have an all inclusive state, it will never work. For one thing the Palestinian family is larger on average than the Israeli family. The only solution is a two state one.
What I meant by getting a British editor was in context to book writing.
No offense taken…
Posted by jeff, on January 12th, 2009 at 12:53 PMsad that israel is allowed to do such things, with no sanctions, or action against it,u cannot take ones land and u cannot lock a group of people in a open air prison, treating them like common animals, and not except a response from them,and than disregard gazan lives, of women and children and civilians as if oh well its hamas fault,
but its okay when russia defended S.O.,the world must sanction and stop them, when georgia did the same as israel is doing.
Posted by mike, on January 14th, 2009 at 12:08 PMArabs did not accept the UN resolution in 1947 for simple reason.
Posted by haiseb, on January 19th, 2009 at 3:31 AMThe owners of Palestine is the Arabs.
Do you accept an UN resulotion that divide CA between Mexico and USA?
What do you mean haiseb ….My grandmother was Palestinian ….PALESTINIAN JEWISH ….HER GRANDMOTHER AND GREAT GRANDMOTHERS WERE FROM HEBRON for many generations .. ..my grandmother was a Hebrew teacher .JEWS HAVE ALWAYS BEEN THERE…. Arabs kicked all the Jews from Arab countries and were made refugees . Many had no choice but to go to Israel ..Where is the compensation for everything they lost? They had keys to their houses ….. .We Sephardic and Mizrahi Jews suffered tremendously by you Arabs because you hate Jews …period . Maybe you can fool the Anglos ..but We know how you think ..!!!!YOU HAVE SO MUCH LAND ALL OVER THE MIDDLE EAST . YET STILL YOU WANT TO DENY JEWS THIS MINUSCULE PIECE OF LAND ONLY BECAUSE THEY ARE JEWS …..NO OTHER REASON ….Enough with the occupation bull …..
Posted by Akilah, on January 21st, 2009 at 9:56 AMAkilah is right 100%. Find one Arab country that is a democracy. As for corruption, this is everywhere, we have plenty right here in the good ol’ USA.
However I think that some Arab countries take it to amazing heights. I have a friend who’s’ wife worked in Afghanistan on reconstruction projects, her experience was that Afghanistan is a lost cause due to ingrained corruption that is evident on every level of the Afghan government.
Posted by jeffe, on January 21st, 2009 at 1:04 PM